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Hacking the I2C interface of Spektrum DX and AR ?


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#141 MorenoEnNYC1

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Posted 22 January 2008 - 04:50 PM

We have lift off! The first successful 2.4GHz MikroKopter flight (I think it’s the 1st) Special thanks to Richard ‘Brashley’ Mr RC-Cam and Arthur P!

1st flight was F L A W L E S S I’m very excited! I’ll have to get use to using my DX7 again. I drained 2 ˝ packs with no glitches or issues…more flying tomorrow. A HUGE thanks for the hard work you all put into this! Absolutely no problems to report. I've tested the 'issue' of lost TX signal and the MK's inability to recognize it when using the converter...it really isn't an issue because once the signal is lost the AR7000 shuts throttle input. You also have the option to set it to a lost signal throttle position which allows the MK a slow descent :D

Edited by MorenoEnNYC1, 22 January 2008 - 04:53 PM.


#142 Mr.RC-Cam

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Posted 22 January 2008 - 08:33 PM

That is good to hear. Did Brashley send one of his to you or did you make one on your own using the latest schematics?

Regarding the failsafe issue, I'll try to work on that. No doubt it would be useful to have the MK detect lost DX7 signals. But as you say, it is not necessary; But if it ain't broke, make it better. :)
- Thomas

#143 MorenoEnNYC1

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Posted 22 January 2008 - 08:57 PM

Hi Mr RC-Cam,

Yes, Brashley sent me a unit, all buttoned up and ready to go. Thanks again for jumping in and assisting...truly amazing!

"But if it ain't broke, make it better" I like that :D :D I probably would feel better if the MK detected a lost signal which would make this solution 100%

Thanks again!

AJ


That is good to hear. Did Brashley send one of his to you or did you make one on your own using the latest schematics?

Regarding the failsafe issue, I'll try to work on that. No doubt it would be useful to have the MK detect lost DX7 signals. But as you say, it is not necessary; But if it ain't broke, make it better. :)



#144 brashley

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Posted 23 January 2008 - 06:21 PM

AJ was the test pilot :D (He is a brave soul). My original plan was to finish up my MK first but AJ was very eager to get his MK flying again so I just went ahead and made two of them. Looks like it works great :) :) :) … The lost signal thing does still make me nervous though. I cant say thank you enough for all your help RC-Cam..... (it actually was fun)

Richard

Edited by brashley, 23 January 2008 - 06:22 PM.


#145 Arthur P.

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 01:54 PM

I believe the normal FC setup is to go to slow descent with neutral roll, tilt and yaw on loss of signal. I.e. the FC software has a failsafe build in. If you have GPS integrated, you might be able to go one step further and program in a return to origin (hoping that there are no high trees or buildings in between ;=)) but I-m not sure how far that development is.

I wonder whether you couldn't simply modify one or two lines of source code in the FC programming. You need it to identify either no signal (current program) or a particular preset of controls which should not normally occur during flight after motor on. If you then set up the Spektrum failsafe to that combination of presets, the FC software should correctly identify it as the receivers signal that it is no longer receiving a signal. Probably only requires one line of code to be added or changed as an or statement to the current failsafe trigger, and one line to identify recovery from signal loss.

Hi Mr RC-Cam,

Yes, Brashley sent me a unit, all buttoned up and ready to go. Thanks again for jumping in and assisting...truly amazing!

"But if it ain't broke, make it better" I like that :D :D I probably would feel better if the MK detected a lost signal which would make this solution 100%

Thanks again!

AJ



#146 Kilrah

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 02:17 PM

If you then set up the Spektrum failsafe to that combination of presets

That's the problem, the spektrum allows setting a failsafe only on the throttle channel.

#147 Arthur P.

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 02:56 PM

That's the problem, the spektrum allows setting a failsafe only on the throttle channel.

From the Spektrum DX7 manual: Note: Fail-safe positions are stored via the stick and switch positions on the transmitter during
binding.

According to this it stores all stick and switch positions, but most people leave the roll, nick, and yaw positions neutral so it would seem only the throttle is stored.

#148 Mr.Pibb

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 03:29 PM

From the Spektrum DX7 manual: Note: Fail-safe positions are stored via the stick and switch positions on the transmitter during
binding.

According to this it stores all stick and switch positions, but most people leave the roll, nick, and yaw positions neutral so it would seem only the throttle is stored.

That's not how mine works. Unless they've changed something recently (which would be nice), all the Spektrum receivers except the 9 channel one only have throttle fail safe and all other channels hold their last position. The do go to the "bound" positions when you first power it up, but if you lose a signal they hold their last position.

#149 Arthur P.

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Posted 24 January 2008 - 03:45 PM

That's not how mine works. Unless they've changed something recently (which would be nice), all the Spektrum receivers except the 9 channel one only have throttle fail safe and all other channels hold their last position. The do go to the "bound" positions when you first power it up, but if you lose a signal they hold their last position.


You're right. Reread the section. The Spektrum manual is far from clear on a number of things. The use two terms: "smartsafe" and "failsafe" and if I understand the text correctly now the "smartsafe" refers to the startup "stick position" programmed, while failsafe indeed retains last control surface positions and the failsafe throttle setting. I'd hardly dare call this "smart"-safe.

#150 LabMaster

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Posted 29 January 2008 - 04:48 PM

We have lift off! The first successful 2.4GHz MikroKopter flight (I think it’s the 1st) Special thanks to Richard ‘Brashley’ Mr RC-Cam and Arthur P!

1st flight was F L A W L E S S I’m very excited! I’ll have to get use to using my DX7 again. I drained 2 ˝ packs with no glitches or issues…more flying tomorrow. A HUGE thanks for the hard work you all put into this! Absolutely no problems to report. I've tested the 'issue' of lost TX signal and the MK's inability to recognize it when using the converter...it really isn't an issue because once the signal is lost the AR7000 shuts throttle input. You also have the option to set it to a lost signal throttle position which allows the MK a slow descent :D


Sorry to disapoint you :-)
i was flying my MK with Spekrtum DX-7 on the MK Meeting at Germany/Cologne in October 07.

As Receiver i where using the WL1000 FS One Wireless Sim Interface ( http://www.spektrumr...?ProdID=SPM1800 )
This receiver outputs a real PPM Signal, but is only useable for short range flying without modifying the receiver antena section.

At the moment i use a own receiver (ppm output) made of a Microcontroller where up to 3 Spectrum receiver Boards can be hooked up http://www.spektrumr...?ProdID=SPM9545

At the moment i'am implementing the AR9000 protocol to get support for the higher channel counts when using suitable RF Modules (http://www.spektrumr...ProdID=SPMMSJR9)

When this is finished it will be a drop in replacement firmware for the AR7000 receiver.

best regards,
Walter

Edited by LabMaster, 29 January 2008 - 04:50 PM.


#151 brashley

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Posted 29 January 2008 - 05:48 PM

-AT-LabMaster: Great to hear your continued progress with these receivers :D :D . I had heard that someone else had it working I just couldn’t find who it was or how. For the moment, this simple converter works as well with no additional receiver modifications.

Richard

Edited by brashley, 29 January 2008 - 05:48 PM.


#152 Arthur P.

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Posted 30 January 2008 - 10:12 AM

Hi Walter,

So you were the first ! And one good and one excellent solution. Would be really great if you could provide more details on your current solution for the DX7, e.g. diagram and firmware / source code.

In principle with your solution I could image that you could even modify the DX7 so that you can put multiple switches onto one channel and then use additional outputs on your "receiver" to split them out again. That would e.g. allow activation of different flight mode, airpressure sensor, compass, different GPS modes, return to home, over a single channel with several switching resulting in different binary numeric values.

Re the WL1000 FS solution, is it only the antenna which needs modification, or is this receiver also restricted to a single module with no ability to add a satelite receiver?

#153 jeffyd123

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Posted 30 January 2008 - 10:34 AM

Great Work Brashley! Congrats To AJ as well... (you and Arthur are my personal heros!)

Ive Been following this thread closely (lurker!) because I am designing my MK to fly near Power Transmission Lines for AP inspection.

I have 2 questions:

1. will a 2.4 GHz radio work better than an FM set as far as rejecting EMI

2. Can you post a parts list & etching diagram?

thanks again

Jeff Delvecchio

#154 LabMaster

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Posted 30 January 2008 - 04:59 PM

Hi Walter,

So you were the first ! And one good and one excellent solution. Would be really great if you could provide more details on your current solution for the DX7, e.g. diagram and firmware / source code.

In principle with your solution I could image that you could even modify the DX7 so that you can put multiple switches onto one channel and then use additional outputs on your "receiver" to split them out again. That would e.g. allow activation of different flight mode, airpressure sensor, compass, different GPS modes, return to home, over a single channel with several switching resulting in different binary numeric values.


That is not so easy, as on the transmitter side the SPI communication between the Microcontroller and the Cypress RF chip seems to be quite complicate, the microcontroller does all the bitstuffing, FEC things and RF Chip registerhandling . To insert more datas it would be nessecary to understand all this in detail. (better get the firmware ripped out of the transmitters microcontroller)

So the things feed into the transmitter RF chip is not that what comes out on the serial communication from the receiver boards.


Re the WL1000 FS solution, is it only the antenna which needs modification, or is this receiver also restricted to a single module with no ability to add a satelite receiver?


there is no possibility to add additional receiver modules to the WL1000, so the only thing that could be done is to tweak the antenna as good as possible, this is not a easy task and seems to be more magic than sience on 2.4Ghz :-) but after a lot of tries i had quite good success, but this is still ne finial solution.

regards,
Walter

Edited by LabMaster, 30 January 2008 - 05:00 PM.


#155 brashley

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 05:55 AM

......
1. will a 2.4 GHz radio work better than an FM set as far as rejecting EMI

2. Can you post a parts list & etching diagram?

thanks again

Jeff Delvecchio


Jeff, I don’t know the answer to 1. above. Needs a smarter person than me.
for 2) I will try to make a Mouser BOM (if I can figure out how) and post the link. For the layout I will have to figure out how to get a 1-to-1 PDF or something.

Actually you need to thanks Mr.Cam for all his help to actually get it to work correctly and Arthur for spearheading this and coming up with the initial idea.

Richard

#156 brashley

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 01:23 PM

PWM-to-PPM V2 parts List: I can create a project at Mouser.com but I cant share it. You should be able to copy and paste the Part Number and Qty into the Mouser BOM import and create your own project or order....

Mouser Part Number--------Quantity---------Desc.----------------------------------------------Ref. Des.
873-AAT3220IQY-33T1-------------1---------------150mA NanoPower VR-------------VR1
583-MM4148-W-----------------------9---------------Signal diode---------------------D1-D9
81-GRM40X105K10L----------------2---------------0805 1uF 10volts----------------C3,C4
81-GRM40X223K50D---------------2----------------0805 0.022uF 50volts------------C1,C2
71-CRCW0805-10K-E3-------------6----------------0805 1/8watt 10Kohms 1%------R1-R6
595-CD74HC221M96----------------1----------------Hi-Spd CMOS Dual----------------IC1
512-MMBT2222A---------------------1----------------Small Signal Transistors NPN------ Q1

Richard

Edited by brashley, 31 January 2008 - 02:25 PM.


#157 jeffyd123

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Posted 01 February 2008 - 08:54 AM

thanks for the parts list Richard. and thanks to MR RC Cam for the great work on this.

#158 Mr.RC-Cam

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Posted 01 February 2008 - 10:30 AM

You are welcome. It was my pleasure to help where I could.
- Thomas

#159 carancho

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Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:26 AM

Here is a picture of Version 1 buttoned up and ready to go. I am only going to use this one for testing though.

Hey Brashley,
Are you willing to sell any pre-built ones? Without the receiver of course... :P

#160 osvaldoljunior

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Posted 12 February 2008 - 02:32 AM

Hi everyone... my quadrocopter is finaly ready. so yesterday i try to test it with ar7000 and it dont works... my board is the an old version i think the november one...
them i see that has a lot of changes and grats results...
my question is does my board version works. i dont have a scope to test it.
one mistake that i see is that i was wiring the ar7000 wrong. the last chanel is ruder.
another thing can you post the schematics here to me?
Another thing... i dont know if the quadrocopter will work with the ppm inverted. does anyone try it?
my is the one of www.uavp.de
Congratulations for your great results.
:D