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Hello All,

Im keen on setting up an onboard camera into my Dynamic Soaring glider. The plane will be moving at pretty high speeds (around 100mph) and will become quite turbulent at times. I dont have a great deal of money to spend however have found this small wireless video camera and reciever for what seems a very good price ($69 AUD).

Ive enquired about it and am told the range is from 100 - 300 m and the picture quality is apparently very good. (apparently)

Anyway check out http://www.oshmens.com/revolution/C0001.html

If you can let me know your thougths that would be great, im pretty keen on getting it.

Cheers Grant

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The one thing I don't see is how much power the transmitter puts out. Send them an e-mail and try to find out.

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This camera system appears to be the same as the Hong Kong sold models that are scattered throughout eBay. Typically they go for about $15 US plus shipping (another $25). The Tx consumes 200mW of power. This is not the RF power. Delivered RF power ranges from about 5mW to 40mW, but most are on the low end of this range.

There is a review of a 200mW 1.2Ghz system on the RC-CAM web site: http://www.rc-cam.com/hk_video.htm.

The CMOS cameras are not the best choice for R/C use. But, they are still fun (and easy targets for a CCD upgrade).

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THanks for the response. Do you think it would be worthwhile getting it just to try or should I really wait until i get some more money and get a better system . I dont really want to spend more than 100USD, Mabey you know of some good camera systems for around that price you could direct me to???

Anotherone Ive looked at looks pretty much the same but has audio aswell, you can check it at http://www.raidentech.com/cokitmiwicos.html

They also have a 2ghz one but im not really sure what the diffence will be.

I guess the question im asking is would the video quality be good enough to actualy see whats going on or would it be all blury and scatured?

Mabey someone knows where I could view a sample video recorded off one of these cameras??

Once again many thanks for your response.

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I guess the question im asking is would the video quality be good enough to actualy see whats going on or would it be all blury and scatured?

With the experience I have with CMOS cameras, I'd say that when you are filming the horizon from a plane, the image is always either too bright or too dark, depending on the camera's choice to adapt itself to the sky or to the ground. To get a clear image of the ground you have to point the cam so the ground represents more than about 75% of the image. The adaptation is pretty slow also.

I don't know if it's the case with all CMOS, but I've also noticed that vibrations don't have the same effect than with CCD's. With a CCD, the entire image gets freezed at the same time, so the worst result is a shaky interlaced image. But with the CMOS it seems to scan the lines one after another, which can lead to ugly deformations sometimes..

BUT of course for $100 you won't get the best system that exists, and it's still worth it to have a view from the air even if the quality is not the best.. all you risk is to spend a bit more for a better system when you'll see what it feels like :P

Mabey someone knows where I could view a sample video recorded off one of these cameras??

Yep, but it's not exactly from a similar system, but a CMOS cam connected to a "standard" 2.4GHz TX/RX system. Could upload a sample, don't have any here right now.

Regards,

Kilrah

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Here is a site that has some 1.2Ghz CMOS video samples: http://fubar1.freeservers.com/RC/Movies/Movies.html

Here is one at that site that will show you what you can expect from a CMOS camera: http://fubar1.freeservers.com/RC/Movies/Ey...electra%202.wmv

Compare that to BlackWidow's system, which has CCD camera: http://www.yb2normal.com/homercam2.zip

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I guess the question im asking is would the video quality be good enough to actualy see whats going on or would it be all blury and scatured?

Inside your house the video quality will be fine. Might be good for putting it on a R/C car lets say. But once you get this in the air, in my opinion you will most likely run out of range very quickly. It will end up being a source of frustration more than anything else. As well as the contrast problems mentioned above.

Personally if I were you I would save up some bucks and get something decent. What can makes this somewhat expensive, is buying a lot of equipment that you do not even use that simply sits in a drawer. Basically wasting good money.

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Had forgotten to mention the horizontal lines generated by the propeller..

Ok, Here is a divx encoded sample video showing about every of the issues you can have with a CMOS cam:

deformations (look at the fuselage with tail view), brightness problems (the bottom cam behaved in a strange manner that day, sometimes too bright and sometimes too dark), saturation (the tail cam did not like the sun on the white wing), propeller (tail cam again).

BTW, this is the only video I've got for now with the full setup (1 CCD for pilot's view, 3 CMOS for wing, tail and bottom view, video switch + TL100). I've cut some parts because the full flight is about 10mins long.

My 1.5m plane was really getting very heavy with all that stuff, but he still accepted to fly, nice of him.

HF gear is a 50mW 2.4GHz system due to the #@¦*+"ç%& laws we have here... We won't beat cyber-flyer's records with that but it's still enough for nice FPV flights if we stay relatively close.

Regards,

Kilrah

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I think ill save a little and try to go with something more worthwhile, Thanks alot for everyones response. Very informative.

Cheers Grant

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I'm new at this but here's another consideration. If you are going to get a cheap setup, you can get ones that they say are 1500mw on ebay. I'm trying one and I'll let you know what I come up with.

Also, I'd either build or buy another rx antenna. I'm going to try the GP patch as it is very cheap and easy to build and has a good reputation on this board.

Another consideration is even if this camera you saw DOES go out to 300 m, that's only about three foot ball fields and isn't really a very big area, considering that most rc tx's are good for three times that distance.

When I first started getting into this video thing four years ago, I spent a fortune on equipment from a reputable company and the stated distance was 1,000 feet, line of sight and the equipment DOES comply with that statement, but I also found out that 1000 feet (300 m) ain't squat when you are flying rc, unless you're going to mount the camera on a park flyer.

I was so disgusted that I basically shelved the whole thing till I built an rc airboat and got the idea for the camera on it and it was a blast then. The boat is rarely more than 500 feet or so away from me and I can put the tx anntenna out where it will always be inline with my rabbit ears ( it tx's on channel 59) and the boat is always relatively stable as far as pitch goes. It works very well for that.

So I decided to do an internet search for some higher powered stuff and came upon some more powerful units on ebay. Yea, I know, I know, they're all junk and all that but if you do some research and actually contact the buyers of some of these cams, you can make an educated choice and get some good deals if you do some research.

If you want, email me and I will send you links once I've tested the three camera setups I have coming.

One that I have is stating a range of up to 8000 ft line of sight and when I asked one of the buyers how his worked he gave it a very favorable rating. He says his transmitts for over a city block in new york between two offices, with no antenna mods and I'd say that has to be a pretty good test, seeing as both have to go through several walls alone in large buildings.

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Oh yea, did you guys notice that the helicopter they have the camera on is like one of those picolo indoor helicopters?

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What are the power supply requirments ?

Dose it cause any interfierence ?

Terry

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So far the only ones I've had any experience with are my 2 channel 59 Tx's.

I power both camera and Tx with a brick of eight AAAs and I'm not sure what the power requirement is but it has to be very minimal. I've powered this setup for hours and hours on a set of alkaline batteries.

I also have three of those cheap "ebay" cameras on order but have only gotten one that is stated to be 800 milliwatt. I haven't had time to fool with it yet, or even to hook it up to see if it works, due to working tons of overtime to pay for all this stuff and a few harley parts....

The 800 milliwatt camera is supposed to be able to take either 8 or 12 volts so I plan to power it like I do my other cameras.

Same goes for the other two cameras, although they are much higher powered according to the ads.

The second one is supposed to be 1500 mw RF and so is the third one, but it also has audio.

As soon as I get all this stuff and get it all figured out I'll post some photos and my experiences with each camera.

I may end up getting a 3000 ma nimh battery pack and charger on 12 volt from one of the security camera websites. They are supposed to be AAA batteries and nimh is lighter than nicad anyway so I think I'd like to go that route.

Anyways I'll post my experiences as soon as I have all three cameras and can compare them, although at least one of the cameras I have ordered sounds like the real McCoy according to one fellow I have emailed in new york. He's so happy he's bought more than one set of them to transmitt between his office and his warehouse.

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Ok.....today I took my 800mw Ebay cheapie up in my plane and did my normal pattern and the video started to fade in and out a bit so I landed and tried another battery. Since the unit uses 9volt, I decided to put a plug on my 1100ma 9.6 volt park flyer pack and hooked it up and tried again. This time the video was completely unbroken during my whole flight. I stayed in the air probably twenty minutes or so and taped the entire flight. It certainly seems to be able to handle the distance of my stock rc transmitter. I'd say I was at least a half mile out and although the camera that comes with this setup is bad, being cmos, the video signal itself was just fine.

I'd leave it stock, with the exception of adding the 9.6 volt parkflyer pack and a CCD camera. I'm waiting on a color CCD camera and it should be here by saturday.

I didn't even use another antenna on my rx and it worked very well in my humble oppinion.

For the average RCer I'd say this will work just fine. Unless you're looking for professional results and just want a video camera to have fun with, I'd recommend this one. At forty bucks, including shipping, I'd say it's a good deal. If anyone wants they can email me at randall1959-AT-yahoo.com and I'll send you a photo and a link to the camera.

post-5-1095961846_thumb.jpg

Edited by randall1959

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I got my ccd camera today and it works very well now. The video is spectacular. No interference with my plane either. I'm still using the system stock, with no antenna mods and so far it's working very well as long as I use my 9.6 volt park flyer battery pack.

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I'm impressed, you are flying a half mile away.

Can we see some video from this flight?

It is worth mentioning that the 1.2 ghz units found on ebay are illegal to operate in the USA... I didn't see this mentioned anywhere in the thread and it is an important consideration for any USA members considering the unit. Not condemning the practice, just stating a fact.

Cheers,

David

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I can't post video as I record directly onto a vhs tape and don't have the equipment necessary to download it. You're right these aren't "legal" but neither are any of the other systems if they go above 10mw RF. Even 2.4 ghz is illegal if you go over 10mw

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Sounds like this cheap setup could be a winner with the ccd cam.

I bought a similar setup from Hong Kong as did Mr rc cam however the TX

is the real let down at only 42mw output. I noticed in your picture that the TX is stand alone. Mine is built in the cam which I realise now to be a disadvantage.

Is your setup 1.2 or 2.4ghz ? Have emailed you for links.

Regards...Mark

post-5-1096147879_thumb.jpg

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Even 2.4 ghz is illegal if you go over 10mw

In the USA, the max allowed effective radiated RF power, for approved license free gear, is less than 1mW. However, higher power is legal to operate with a ham license. It is NOT hard to earn the required technician class license: www.arrlorg

However, the cheap "1.2Ghz" eBay systems are not legal to use, regardless of power. They operate in the reserved aviation spectrum.

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On the spec sheet of the camera I got it said that the camera could be anywhere from 900 mhz to 1.2 ghz, depending on where the camera was headed to. I haven't looked into it yet so I'm not exactly sure what frequency this camera is on.

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The people I ordered my camera from are quick to reply so I asked them what frequency my camera was on and they assured me it's on the 900 mhz band. But just to be sure I'll find someone that's into ham radio and ask them to check the freq. In the meantime I won't use it and start studying for that tech no code license.........On some of the "spy cam" websites it says that 1.2 ghz is also used by law enforcement, and some of those setups are sold in the us by us companies. They also sell 1.2 ghz cameras and receivers for industrial units. So does this mean that if my company were to purchase one of these that they are also violating the law? Just curious.

Edited by randall1959

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Most of the so called 1.2GHZ systems are actually on 1.1GHZ so a frequency counter test is a must!!!

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So does this mean that if my company were to purchase one of these that they are also violating the law? Just curious.

Unless the RF device was specifically labeled as a registered FCC Part 15 approved device, your company would need to obtain a commercial Part 90 license to operate it (and they must follow the Part 90 regs). I have yet to see an eBay/Hong Kong cheapy, or any low cost system for that matter, that meets the Part 90 regs.

So, in a nutshell, it would be illegal for a business to operate these cheap imported wireless Tx's that are not Part 15 approved.

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I have several friends that are private pilots and one that is qualified to fly a 747 and this is what I have been told. Yes, maybe the cheapie ebay cameras DO operate on aircraft frequencies, but the equipment that they use is much higher powered than anything we could buy off ebay, so if you operate one of these cheapie cameras, you have more to worry about with interference from them than vice versa. It's much like the old cb days when some of us had linear amplifiers. We could "walk" all over the guys that used stock radio equipment and have a conversation in spit of their feeble attempts at blocking our signals. I would also suspect that aircraft use "frequency hopping" technology as to nullify any effect that equipment of this nature would have. The only time I ever heard about "Uncle Charlie" coming down on someone was if you had a base station next to someone that had an antenna instead of cable, and you lit up that person's tv to the point that they filed an FCC complaint, and I can only ever remember that happening once. As for myself, although I don't even have a cb anymore, I used to operate a President HR 2510 with a 3000 watt linear that would dim my house lights when I keyed up.............The legal limit in those days was somewhere around 2 watts.

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The catch-22 of these transmitters is that people are attacted to them because they are so cheap, but in order to verify the transmitter is legal they have to spend $100 more dollars to test it!

For anyone interested in operating legally, this is $99 well spent:

http://www.oselectronics.com/ose_p9.htm

Randall, did you run that 3000 watt amp on house wiring? Assuming 100% amplifier efficiency, you'd be drawing over 25 amps...

David

Edited by DCarter

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