Jump to content
cyber-flyer

Members only FPV forum

Recommended Posts

It's interesting just how different each of us are. I'm not a serious racer, but I like to vary what I do when I FPV. I'd love to have useful HD video on a fast mini quad (but I recognize the technical challenge with fast moving digital video). The pitching and tilting adds some excitement to the ride and I need to see this action to help coordinate my thumbs on the sticks.

Yeah, it took me awhile to come to the conclusion that steady video is better than the one coupled to the fuselage. In the early days I couldn't think of it because it ment lost control of the aircraft. But today, flight stabilizers and autopilots can take care of quick corrections. May be it is just me but I love the steady video that the brushless gimbals produce.

Can't wait to see how FrSky's next radio, targeted more to high end customers will do.

Please, do tell the rumur mill...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm maybe I need to look into getting a 250 quad!

Kilrah your comments are spot on and this open forum is fine for most things but there are times when you dont want the rest of the world what you are doing or going to do. Not necessarily because you have commercial ambitions but you may want to stay under the radar just to avoid unwanted attention.

I dont suppose it would get heavily used but it would be nice to have the option.

Kilrah I would also be interested in any info you have on a parachute system?

As for the hobby, I said before all the main goals have been met and exceeded and are available off a Chinese shelf at the click of a button. Now its time to enjoy what we have :)

Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm maybe I need to look into getting a 250 quad!

Since you are dabbling in R/C cars, I think the transition to a 250 quad would be a no-brainer. The concept is the same, except the track is a few feet off the ground. Plus, on those non-competitive days you can go off-roading nearly anywhere (the more obstacles the better). Crashes are cheap, usually just a broken prop.

There's a ton of mini-quad racing videos on YouTube. It's not a racing video, but here's one (of many) on the tube that demonstrates the agility of the little quads in the hands of a capable pilot.

As far as your concern for safety, the small quads are flown at very low altitude in small areas. Pick a spot away from people and have fun. I don't race or go wild-azz crazy, but I rarely go above 10 meters height with my 330. I've been selecting parts for a new FPV 250, but the work load has been slowing me down.

As for the hobby, I said before all the main goals have been met and exceeded and are available off a Chinese shelf at the click of a button. Now its time to enjoy what we have

You're getting to think like those old guys, time to bring out the kid that is still in there. I'm interested in making my FPV hobby activities better and/or more fun. So one eye is always on the lookout for DiY opportunities that help do that.

Edited by Mr.RC-Cam

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You're getting to think like those old guys, time to bring out the kid that is still in there. I'm interested in making my FPV hobby activities better and/or more fun. So one eye is always on the lookout for DiY opportunities that help do that

Ha ha your right. I do have a couple of things in the pipeline but they will have to wait until I build my new workshop next year. Maybe when I get that kitted out I will get back into some interesting projects.

Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But IMHO DJI's Phantom is a great product and we shouldn't dismiss or degrade it just because it is affordable and plug and play.

Of course not, the Phantom is an awesome machine. And yes things will eventually settle for good I'm sure, but in the meantime it causes a lot of mess and uncertainty.

DJI forcing things by putting millions of quads into all hands does both good and bad, good because it pushes for clarifying things, but bad because they've now started a 15-year period of negociations, regulation rounds, and general unstability in the field that nobody wants to have to go through and that was avoidable if people were a bit responsible. See the whole mess with the FAA lately, in one year UAV operations have gone through pretty much every status between OK and totally illegal, and it doesn't look like it's going to settle any time soon. So much for trying to live from what you like in that field when you just bought 20k of equipment and flying it is suddenly illegal again, and you have absolutely zero say. Then you have to do paperwork. Then it goes back again. Then you'll probably have to get a licence at some point... I.e. you end up with more overhead than actual work again.

Not talking of the guys who start going out with guns wanting to shoot at multis because they've seen in the media that if they seen one it's probably spying on them.

And not either talking of FAAs latest endeavour, yes, aiming at the whole RC hobby, that has just popped up.

Where I am I can't say I care much nor see trouble trouble ahead now, but I definitely wouldn't want to have to deal with it the way you'll have to in the USA :)

But fast pitching and tilting video is not fun. While it helps figure out drone orientation it takes away from flying experience.

Absolute opposite to me, the view following the aircraft's attitude is to me 90% of the "feeling of flight" i.e. feeling of really being in the thing and going under that tree with movements that are tightly connected to my actions like in real life, as opposed to jsut looking at something happening on a screen.

Then tilting and pitching is only as fast as you make it ;) It's all a question of piloting. I absolutely hate those videos where they fly in Attitude mode i.e. angular speeds are controlled by the FC and are as fast as it can make them, giving highly "harsh" movements. But fly rate mode, with low throws, add a lot of anticipation and good trajectory prediction skills and you've got beautiful flights like the one below. Highly dynamic, free and interesting, yet very smooth.

(not my video, but my favorite out there in this category)

Same as on a plane really, when I FPV an airplane it's to feel in there. Wouldn't happen if I had no view of the aircraft and a fixed angle.

When I fly with a stabilized gimbal I just "steer a camera" that could just as well be on a cable, mast or crane that happens not to have movement constraints. It's excellent too, just not the same thing. I like both, but for different purposes. One makes me fly, the other gives me a great image and perspective but it's just a camera angle. I'm looking at a pretty picture but not flying.

(quite old now, before 3 axis BLGs)

Please, do tell the rumur mill...

I hate rumours, but you'll find the known facts here ;)

FrSky in Chicago!

Kilrah I would also be interested in any info you have on a parachute system?

http://www.opale-paramodels.com

They do the chutes and mounting/release systems, not sure if they also sell the automatic trigger devices yet, I know they were looking into it. Have seen some in other places (some guys have asked about configuration for them on the Taranis threads).

There are other options, often more expensive. DJI is apparently coming up with their own too I've read, but the descent speeds I saw were scary, hopefully they're wrong.

As far as your concern for safety, the small quads are flown at very low altitude in small areas.

:P

EDIT: Hmm, forum seems to only parse 2 youtube links per post.

Edited by Kilrah
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So much for trying to live from what you like in that field when you just bought 20k of equipment and flying it is suddenly illegal again, and you have absolutely zero say.

An example I just received, apparently the French have announced a new parachute requirement for 2015 for the "involved" usage cases, that none of the existing systems satisfies. So if you want to build a machine for that use case now where a parachute is already required you'll have to shell out a good $1000 for your chute system, but that's only for 4 months as it will not be compliant anymore then. And then you'll have to stop operating until someone finds a way to build a system that satisfies the requirement...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I gave up trying to make a living out of this stuff a long time back. The battle with regulation and the weather make it too hard. There are much easier and more reliable ways to earn money.

Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kilrah, I've looked at all three videos and actually liked the last one best. The first looks like fun but it reminds me of a race. While it is fun to be the driver of a racing car, watching driver's view is not pleasant. It may be just me then, but my vision of ideal FPV craft is the one with the stabilized camera (may be slowly following craft orientation) and some sort of visual feedback (like AHI) to let pilot see the exact orientation.

You have asked the question - are we in FPV to have fun at the controls or watch smooth video. I guess I'd like to have the best of both worlds.

Edited by cyber-flyer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While it is fun to be the driver of a racing car, watching driver's view is not pleasant.

Of course, what I mean is that when I see that I get the "That's what I want to do" feeling - then it really gets pleasant once I do.

It may be just me then, but my vision of ideal FPV craft is the one with the stabilized camera (may be slowly following craft orientation) and some sort of visual feedback (like AHI) to let pilot see the exact orientation.

That's what we have on our "imagery" machines, stabilised gimbal but with AHI on the OSD. To me it doesn't work at all, it's like trying to fly FPV while also looking at the model, you end up not being able to follow either.

Either I'm looking at the image and the AHI makes no sense to me as it's completely contradictory to what I see, or I concentrate on the AHI and then don't even see the image anymore. Maybe with a lot of training...

There are some guys who fly H quads with a 2 axis gimbal in front, need to find a video again. AFAIK they don't use an OSD but simply fly in Attitude mode with altitude lock i.e. in the "shooting" style, and rely on the quad's attitude equalling their stick input. Optical flow does the rest to provide a (delayed) feedback that allows to fine-tune the trajectory. At least that way there are no contradictory visual cues, and that I can see myself doing even if it's not really my cup of tea. No way to fly that in manual/rate mode though.

Edited by Kilrah

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree that classical style AHI will be counterintuitive. What required imho is a reversed AHI, so that you see craft's orientation like you are looking at it from above and slightly behind, instead of an imaginary horizon line. But possibly even better yet some sort of sensory feedback, like a servo pushing on your hand left or right, etc. Well, it is just an idea.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes when your primary goal is video or stills its good to have the stabilised view of the camera taking the shots but a reversed AHI type legend would be good to tell you exactly what the aircraft is doing.

Terry

Edited by Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Somebody mention me?

I've been absent too, I moved home, downsized and totally modified the new place to our liking - took nearly 2 years, but it's about there now.

I got a decent man-cave out of it and it's nearly finished so I can get back into things again and blow the dust off some of my models and equipment that have been mothballed.

Even in 2 years things have changed so much and as Terry mentioned, my brother is now interested in FPV having purchased a Phantom and I'm helping kit it out for FPV (complete with gimbal)! He is not overly interested in all the technicalities and I'm kind of the opposite. Neither of us criticise one another for our different approach to the hobby.

I've just built a little 250 quad for bashing about with, but my spare time is still a bit thin and the UK weather is rubbish at the moment but it seems quite addictive.

Really interested in all the comments about the DIY side of things and it's difficult to be truly inventors these days & probably we are more innovators?

Nigel.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...